RE: A Response to the critique at "The undersigned Bnei Torah of Lakewood
Truth to tell, the guys who signed this broadside are straightforward, honest brokers, Youngeleit whose living quarters are the sophistication of simplicity.
There's no nexus here whatsoever to the "Better homes & Gardens" you speak of. If the portals of higher learning are wide open what do you expect? No one denies a relatively new phenomenon that people of a stripe foreign to kollel, have swelled its ranks - It's a mixed bag - but then again these are the chevra with the smartphones.
There's a snowballs chance in Gan Eden that they'd protest a virtual event! your accusation parodies itself. With editorial deft you avoid the $64,000 question. Agudah is the lodestar of Torah Yahadus why shouldn't it opt for the gold standard & host a convention of conference calls!
You profess either ignorance or naivete about the children's hour- remember how 6 months ago thousands of tinokos shel Bais Rabban were introduced on a nightly program for Torah to the preminent rabbinic leader of Modern Orthodoxy? His worldview is one track, ours on another, and never the "Twain Shall Meet".
Kudos to Agudah for enhancing kavod Shamayim by changing the venue of the kids hour to a conference call and not zoom.
Actually the virtual issue, the danger of internet becoming the new normal, is a microcosm of a much larger vexing problem - an unwillingness to follow the directives of the manhigei Yisrael, Rav Moshe Feinstein, Rav Yaakov Kamenetzky, Rav Pam, Rav Elya Svei, Rav Mordechai Gifter, Rav Chaim Epstein who charted the course for American Jewry. It's unfortunate that the heimishe media i.e. Mishpacha that is replete with it's own brand of Adam Schiffs and Jerome Nadlers whose groupthink is light years from the uncompromising fealty instilled in us by these Torah luminaries.
Witness the current situation, someone gets Jonathan Pollard out of Jail and then a newly formed organization cons some 25 thousand genuine shomrei Torah into Herzl's Bais Assurim enclave the W.Z.O.
You hear the smith brothers cough drop lookalikes calling "Im Tirzu Ain Zu Aguda!
Be informed no one will rewrite the narrative. The veteran bnei Torah here are a savvy gritty resilient bunch who are cyberspace capable if need be. Don't doubt for a moment their resolve and reach.
Be aware if anyone tries to tweak mesorah or attempts to maneuver us with a 98mph fastball heater, the guys in the clubhouse will start banging on cans. In summation your message is upended by the vast majority of ehrliche youngeleit who live within the modest parameters that are characteristic of a ben Torah. These yeshivaleit cling tenaciously to the mores and ethos of the aforementioned gedolei yisrael.
With Almighty's help, the more things change the more our 3500 year old mesorah, the life substance of our people, will stay the same. Amen Ken Yehi Ratzon
Submitted.
I HEAR I HEAR ...JUST DO TESHUVA
ReplyDeleteTHATS ALL
SOMETHING NUCLEAR BIG IS COMING AND YOU AREA ALL ASLEEP EITHR WILLINGLY OR FOOLISHLY
DEEP DEEP DEEP SLEEP
A week late but nevertheless a machaah had to be made. Surprised that the rant on Lakewood gashmiyus was posted in a way that bashmutzed the kollel guys in BMG with rechilus and motzie shem Ra on a vaad affiliated website. But than again they also called innocent lakewood reidents bad apples so now it makes sense
ReplyDeleteThe yeshivisha writer returns dropping another A bomb from the payload of the Enola Gay
ReplyDeleteNagasaki was bigger
DeleteUsing archaic english doesn't make you sound more intelligent, or add credence to your letter. It comes of as trying to sound bigger than you are and stroke your own ego with your big words.
ReplyDeleteDoes it bother you that a yeshiva guy could write or do you feel that the caveman are all not educated and writing belongs only to the intellectuals of the frum media
DeleteThis 'writer' cannot write. He thinks using long words makes him seem really photosynthesis. His vocabulary is quite corpulent, as is his rotund posterior, and he has ample resources to spew the hindquarter production manifest in this screed.
Delete“It comes of” you probably meant “It comes off”...
DeleteThat diatribe about gashmiyus reeked of not only jeleousy but also of sinas am haaretz ltalmidei chachomim and that compelled the author/s to attack yeshiva guys on a seperate issue because they made a machha about the aguda convention on the internet. The Amharatzus showed with the classic example of
ReplyDeleteטענו חיטין, והודה לו בשעורין
There is no excuse for lambasting an entire program because they hosted a Talmid Chocham who's hashkafos you think you don't agree with. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a psul in him that doesn't reek of pure sinas chinam.
ReplyDeleteWho?!
DeleteThe hashkafos are total opposites why expose kids from litvish yeshiva backgrounds to other machnos.
DeleteBecause people can hear conflicting opinions and survive. People aren't snowflakes, not everything they hear do they have to agree with. Kefira is one thing, but if it is just a different hashkafa, it is fine.
DeleteWe let our kids see chassidim and hear their derashos, even though that isn't our hashkafah. Lubavitch are making a farbrengen here in town this motzei shabbos, and it is just fine.
It seems there is a major misunderstanding over here.
ReplyDeleteThe letter on the unnamed site was badly written, but made a valid point. For some reason, the whole world is responsible to fight Israeli fights. The yardstick of kanous is how far a person goes in matters that are relevant to himself, not thousands of miles away. When a town like Lakewood, in a few short years, is unrecognizable to many of us who came less than twenty years ago, we have a problem.
Stop dealing with Zionism, we have our own collection of problems. When a town full of Torah is the Kosher eating capital of the East Coast, when signs are hanging in Shuls advertising Avos uBanim, where fathers can go for physical training on Motzei Shabbos with their sons, when luxury cars are becoming the norm, and it is hard for a child to go to school without the latest in accessories, we have our own problem.
Stop making Israeli issues into ours. Let them take care of theirs, and we will take care of ours. Israeli issues serve as a distraction from our own problems.
The gashmiyus problem has nothing to do with most kollel guys and more than 65% of the general population. It is painting an entire community with a problem that was imported through opening Lakewood as a town for all instead of what it used to be a yeshiva town. what appears to some as an Israeli issue, to bnei torah it is a klal yisrael issue. Joining wzo is something that pertains to all of klal yisrael.
DeleteTo 'Bnei Torah' it is a klal issue. That is why most Bnei Torah that I know have no clue about this whole issue.
DeleteThere are some nebach cases here in town who can't and don't learn, but want the kavod of learning. So they created a concept of a Ben Torah, someone who be'etzem learns, nur punkt today he is busy with giyus and tziyonus and tznius and who knows what. He only met the chitzoniyus, has no idea what it means to actually try and understand a Tosfos. Those people have issues with Eretz Yisroel and whatnot.
who writes in this "style"?
ReplyDeleteare you trying to show off?
we have a mesorah on showing off too!
It's only showing off if you consider poor command of English and an inability to express oneself clearly and succinctly to be a maaloh.
DeleteThis article is totally unreadable. There is a huge amount of misused words, grammatical mistakes and general poppycock, that he tries to masquerade with a thin veneer of education.
DeleteLipstick on a davar acher.
whose groupthink is light years from the uncompromising fealty
DeleteDoes the author here even see the irony? Did he read this before he pressed send?
this article had a lot of invective, but it also was a lodestar. kudos to the author for his fealty.
ReplyDeleteThis is unreadable.
ReplyDeleteit took some time to figure out what you really wanted to say but lets talk about one point "cons some 25 thousand genuine shomrei Torah " how can that be are we so stupid that we can get conned? were the other gedolei moetzes or rosh yeshivas also conned ? the am hanivchar & eney haedah dont get conned ( by helbrans we got conned inc. the list of roshei yeshiva u mentioned) this was a sincere machlokes of technical principles which arent really nogea anymore for a potential gain
ReplyDeleteGreat letter! I didn’t see the original letter that this writer was responding to, nevertheless I thoroughly enjoyed this article as it was intelligently written and brought out excellent points! Thanks Hefkervelt for being the forum for us!
ReplyDeleteYou hear the smith brothers cough drop lookalikes calling "Im Tirzu Ain Zu Aguda!
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone know what this paragraph is supposed to mean? Who are the smith brothers? I never met them in the Yeshiva's Otzar, the Tumim doesn't mention them. What do they have to do with anything?
I guess I am too baalebatish to know this kind of stuff. I don't even possess a Camry, how can I know this stuff?
Theodor Herzl looks like the guy in the advertisment for smith brothers cough drop mit dee langeh burd. herzls famous phrase im tirzu ein zo agada
DeleteThis article, and the entire comments chain has been such a great ride!
ReplyDeleteI am getting some popcorn, and hoping it keeps going :-)
Pure fun HOCKING!
Keep it up! (not being facetious or snarky here, go back and read it yourself. Its epic)
Yeshivish sophistication
ReplyDeleteIt Behooves the citadel to manifest a paradox of epic manifestation of antidisestablishmentarianism to ascertain the juxtaposition and palpable feeling that transcends loftiness imbued with Torah equilibrium
Outdated. Today the oilam is shvacher.
DeleteSincerely,
George Will
Can we ask Google Translate to do Yeshivish or Hefkerveltish?
ReplyDeleteVery surprised that an official machaa was not made in yeshiva about the besmirching and Motzie shem ra of the youngeleit learning in BMG, on the Lakewood vaads website. the article was despicable and disgusting shame on all those who were involved and took part in writing it and publicizing it, Chazal say very scary things about those who say מאי אהני ליה רבנן
ReplyDelete