Many wonder, is nothing sacred anymore? Selichos, for centuries klal yisrael approached it with fear and trepidation as the preparation for the yemei hadin, unfortunately it has now turned into full blown concerts and kumzits style events. The Piyut says זוחלים ורועדים we tremble and shiver as we beg Hashem to forgive us. Instead we see live broadcasts and videos of these new selichos concerts each one crazier than the next. You wont see a clip of how selichos is said in a regular normal shul the way it always was.
Some argue these concerts is the only way people feel they can connect and feel close to hashem as it says לשמוע אל הרינה ואל התפילה. It wasn't until the emergence of the Carlebach style selichos that this phenomenon took off. In previous generations shuls had chazonim who would lead the service but it was not in the form of a musical happy concert. It was a soul stirring prayer in a serious atmosphere. Maybe this is what the generation needs otherwise people wont come to shul or get inspired but its definitely not the norm.
(Submitted via Comment)
I was at a cousin's wedding about a year ago, and asked the soloist why is he singing miBan siach to haNeshamah lach? He said its the new thing. And he is a chassid of malovany (anti carlebach davening).
ReplyDeleteI think the most pernicious part of this is the people who take these sorts of approaches to Yoddishkeit – which may be necessary, but are certainly bidieved, and portray them as L'chatchila, & even somehow better than the traditional approach.
ReplyDeleteTook the words out of everyone's mouth! I wonder if in a generation it will only be a few serious yeshivos that have regular selichos and the standard is the concert!
ReplyDeleteAnd lets suppose that happens.? How do u know that your way is any better? Just necause youve been doing it for so many years means nothing. You know when sara shnirer opened up the first bais yakov , she had lots of resistance from gedolim for the same reason. Take a look today what her insistence brought out.
DeleteAnd experts will be opining what's wrong with the yeshivos that they make a happy event like slichos in to a serious one.
DeleteYou may be right but two points please. First of all I didn't say what is right or wrong I only commented that in a generation it will be the standard in most places other than serious yeshivos. Second of all seforim going back hundreds and hundreds of years discuss the seriousness of yemei selichos and it's not something that we happen to be doing for many years that maybe wrong. It has been the standard probably as long as since the selichos were instituted.
DeleteI believe that if you actually believe you are being judged for life or death you won't be busy making concerts it's like someone pulling a gun on you and you start dancing.
DeleteHave you ever been at a carlbach style slichos? Based on your comments I would say "no". The people by many of those slichos are more into the davening and slichos than in many other places. Now there are also many old style places that people are serious. Just don't go knocking people who get their seriousness in a different way than you.
Deletehaving grown up in a large synagogue with a chazan and the works there was nothing soul stirring for me as a child it was an opera show as far as I was concerned. Ill take a carlbach minyan any day over the cantorial shows of yesteryear.
ReplyDeleteAdd some heart and soul into slichos don't just mumble some Jewish words mean it with music it's beautiful if you didn't go to some Kumzitz your missing out!!
ReplyDeleteIf you know what the words mean when you say them, it is impossible not to say it with heart unless your soul is severely damaged.
DeleteIf you sing it, and don't know what the words mean, then you heart and soul maybe misguided.
"Mumble some Jewish words" is that how you view selichos? Did you ever even attempt to find out what these words mean?
DeleteFrom your point of view, why even bother with Selichos, maybe their are other songs that have better tunes "and can stir your soul"
Everyone gets inspired in different ways. Just like you lije certain foods, just like u like to learn certain mesechtas white others like to learn instead tanach. Leave every be and be inspired the way they want it. No where does it say that selichos cant be with regesh and music to accompany it.
ReplyDeleteAbraham was a teenage radical,going against the grain,smashing his dad's idols. We need more radicals,not clueless ,complacent sheep
ReplyDeleteWhat we need is people who don't always condescendingly refer to a whole tzibur with derogatory names. Such as sheep.
Delete"A teenage radical", that is a very misguided understanding. Avraham was a very deep thinking person, who had the highest levels of self sacrifice and self control, not exactly the image of teenage radical.
DeleteThe smashing of his fathers idols, was because idol worship is a sin, not because he needed to scratch a rebellious itch.
Furthermore, comparing Avraham reveling against sin, to people changing the way things were done by the greatest Gedolim in history, shows a lack of critical thinking ability.
As my father a"h used to say "gut gezogt nor vainig". The era of Moshiach is a totally confusing one. We all need a brocho to stay with the program until the grand Finale!
ReplyDeleteKvch't
What do you mean? The music we listen to today is R"L is pure goyish music with a goyish team that effects your neshama with just changing the words to Jewish words
ReplyDeleteThe Bal Shem Hakodosh and Rabeinu ZY"A saw way back the void of later generations. The derech today is leaning towards their teachings and paths that they paved for us .
ReplyDeleteThe Bal Shem lived in an Era when people worked from a young age and weren't able to learn and didn't have the ability or time to learn, certainly not with the geshmack of mesukim medvash.
DeleteIf there are those who find themselves in a similiar situation, then I guess it's still an option.
An born yarei chait, v'lo am Haaretz chassid.
Today's breslov lunatics have nothing to do with Rav nachman, or the Baal shem.
DeleteLove the way you packaged 80,000 people in one name. There are thousands of breslover that are serious talmidie chachomim and serious people.
DeleteIf you're otherwise not going to say selichos, go to the concert and enjoy. At least you say selichos.
ReplyDeleteI grew up in a Yeshivish Seviva, and was taught that concerts for slichos are a shanda. So I dont go to slichos at all.
I'm a good Jew, you're a good Jew, he's a good Jew, she's a good Jew. And anything bad you've done or are doing doesn't matter. All you need to do is think you're a tzadik, and you are a tzadik. I've absolved you, now come join my selichos.
ReplyDelete