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Thursday, November 14, 2024
Standing Up For Kavod Hatorah
Article in the Lakewood shopper following the tactics used in the local elections
Great article but disagree about the schnall vote. If anything it was the biggest bullying and arm twisting of the roshei yeshiva and rabbinom. No one was allowed to voice their opinion rabbonim were approached to keep their mouths shut and to change their usual voting opinions. This was a campaign by balei batim who needed some tovos in Trenton from the assembly. They used the tuition card to get the olam to vote Rav Elya Ber clearly spoke out against it to over 10 people at a house in Lakewood after getting information that there would be a gzeiras chinuch attached with any govt funding for tuition. when his words were publicized a massive campaign went out by having 2 other roshei yeshiva say in the name of Rav Elya Ber that he did not say that. Rav Elya Ber personally was not publicly chozer. Turns out that when the tuition bill was introduced the teachers union and lgbt groups lined up with lawsuits ready to fight the bill. In the end it was pulled while a year later tuition in Lakewood went up even more.. As evident by this general election some are calling New Jersey a swing state which puts a big question on the strategy to have lakewood vote democratic
When you are Daas Torah because you're famous powerful, when your Daas Torah is used as a cudgel to destroy others, When Daas Torah is bandied about to increase power stature and wealth.Then generations of talmidim are brought up understanding precisely what Daas Torah really means. The Chazon ish Brisker Rav R moshe for some reason did not demand people follow Their Daas Torah or else..... Maybe that's why we All followed.
Agree. But also- it's my personal opinion that rosh yeshivas should stay out of politics. I don't remember gedolei hador in the past coming out and not only endorsing a candidate- definitely not publicly, in writing, and also insinuating that those who vote for a different candidate are basically being over on a doraysa.
The writer of the article has his own political fiefdom and is upset that he doesn’t call the shots. Blaming it on the Roshei Yeshiva is disingenuous and sad. The Roshei Yeshiva most certainly are consulted and followed. They are strong principled people and are not easily manipulated. Shame on him for this sour grapes article.
When “Daas Torah” is used in the social and political context that it is used today, of course, it will be misused and abused to take advantage of others. The others being taken advantage of are both those who are officially being promoted as “Daas Torah” or those who are being told to listen to it. Before you start screaming at me , I was very , very burnt In my personal life because of my naïve following of “Daas Torah” on a personal issue.
As one well know Rosh Yeshiva ztz’l put it about Daas Torah. When he was growing up in Warsaw every neighborhood had at least one Rav who knew Shas by heart and was a boki in Rishonim and poskim. But those who were considered people to listen to their personal opinions because of Daas Torah were very, very few. Today those who know Shas by heart and are bokeim in Rishonim and poskim are very, very few(if any such people remain at all) . But those who are considered people to listen to their personal opinions because of Daas Torah are so easy to find…
Did the Rosh Yeshiva review this article before it went to print?
ReplyDeleteIf he really was concerned about Kavod hatorah he wouldn’t be making gedolim sound like fools that get pressured and strong-armed into doing things
ReplyDeleteVery well said.
Delete"Daas Torah doesn't count when I don't agree." Lakewood Ir HaModern Orthodox!
ReplyDeleteGreat article but disagree about the schnall vote. If anything it was the biggest bullying and arm twisting of the roshei yeshiva and rabbinom. No one was allowed to voice their opinion rabbonim were approached to keep their mouths shut and to change their usual voting opinions. This was a campaign by balei batim who needed some tovos in Trenton from the assembly. They used the tuition card to get the olam to vote
ReplyDeleteRav Elya Ber clearly spoke out against it to over 10 people at a house in Lakewood after getting information that there would be a gzeiras chinuch attached with any govt funding for tuition. when his words were publicized a massive campaign went out by having 2 other roshei yeshiva say in the name of Rav Elya Ber that he did not say that. Rav Elya Ber personally was not publicly chozer.
Turns out that when the tuition bill was introduced the teachers union and lgbt groups lined up with lawsuits ready to fight the bill. In the end it was pulled while a year later tuition in Lakewood went up even more..
As evident by this general election some are calling New Jersey a swing state which puts a big question on the strategy to have lakewood vote democratic
When you are Daas Torah because you're famous powerful, when your Daas Torah is used as a cudgel to destroy others, When Daas Torah is bandied about to increase power stature and wealth.Then generations of talmidim are brought up understanding precisely what Daas Torah really means.
ReplyDeleteThe Chazon ish Brisker Rav R moshe for some reason did not demand people follow Their Daas Torah or else..... Maybe that's why we All followed.
The Roshei Yeshiva are adults.
ReplyDeleteIf they can't handle pressure, let them hand over the reins of power to others and focus on the talmidei Hayeshiva's success.
Agree. But also- it's my personal opinion that rosh yeshivas should stay out of politics. I don't remember gedolei hador in the past coming out and not only endorsing a candidate- definitely not publicly, in writing, and also insinuating that those who vote for a different candidate are basically being over on a doraysa.
DeleteAre they all?
ReplyDeletehttps://theantitzemach.blogspot.com/2007/12/gedolei-ha-what.html?m=1
ReplyDeleteStanding Up For
The writer of the article has his own political fiefdom and is upset that he doesn’t call the shots. Blaming it on the Roshei Yeshiva is disingenuous and sad. The Roshei Yeshiva most certainly are consulted and followed. They are strong principled people and are not easily manipulated. Shame on him for this sour grapes article.
ReplyDeleteThe writer spoke to the roshei yeshiva before printing the article
DeleteWhen “Daas Torah” is used in the social and political context that it is used today, of course, it will be misused and abused to take advantage of others. The others being taken advantage of are both those who are officially being promoted as “Daas Torah” or those who are being told to listen to it. Before you start screaming at me , I was very , very burnt In my personal life because of my naïve following of “Daas Torah” on a personal issue.
ReplyDeleteSame here
DeleteDaas Torah is what bully askanim do and use to justify their wicked plans. Don't be fooled
ReplyDeleteAs one well know Rosh Yeshiva ztz’l put it about Daas Torah. When he was growing up in Warsaw every neighborhood had at least one Rav who knew Shas by heart and was a boki in Rishonim and poskim. But those who were considered people to listen to their personal opinions because of Daas Torah were very, very few. Today those who know Shas by heart and are bokeim in Rishonim and poskim are very, very few(if any such people remain at all) . But those who are considered people to listen to their personal opinions because of Daas Torah are so easy to find…
ReplyDelete